How soon things change ...

[binidj]

I know I shouldn't go anywhere near it, but every now and then something prompts me to go to the Harts website. Of course once I'm there I just can't help sniffing around and occasionally I dig up something like the following in the Ancestors of Albion section:

The Architect
The Architect was originally an Imperial ancestor and one that lost much power after the destruction of the Empire. He represents wealth, prosperity and civilisation ... and encourages his followers to see such things as signs of personal growth. Worship of the Architect is on the increase, especially in the southern duchies of Cornwall and Winchester. He is however often shunned by Albion's more tribal races (such as the elves).

Now I know this is bollocks on account of how I helped JFS to write it. Ordfinarily I wouldn't bother to raise this but I was fairly sure that confirmation that this was utter bollocks had been found by players several years ago.

I know it's none of my business any more but still ... it's annoying to see something that you have written and were once quite proud of, changed beyond all recognition. A bit like CS Lewis coming back to discover that Jadis had been re-written as one of Aslan's helpers.

Comments

[westernind.livejournal.com]

hang on a mo - wasn't the Architect the avatar of the supergribbly Enemy? And a big faker? (Simon says yeah, he thought that was in the plot document he handed over when he quit.)

Makes you wonder about real-life prophets, eh.

[binidj.livejournal.com]

Yep, the Enemy (aka the Void Entity) made up the Architect as part of its plan to destroy Edreja's Ancestors.

[wildwinter.livejournal.com]

Yes, I too, thought it odd (being a Hart, these days). But then players do have a three event memory-span.

Count yoursel(f/ves) lucky; we're still in the game system, and plot we were running as recently as last year has now been completely rewritten. Some things have clearly 'unhappened'. Despite us leaving possibly the most copious notes (an entire Wiki full of it) ever handed on to another plot team in that faction...

Tum-ti-tum. I just ignore it. I mourn some of the untold stories; but shrug my shoulders and feel just a teeny bit superior about it all. "Look at what you _could_ have had..."

And I count the free hours I have, and count my blessings...

[kneeshooter]

Put the keyboard down and walk away. You have twenty seconds to comply.

[woodbrook.livejournal.com]

I would say that information in that section is currently 'what we know ic' as there are some bits on Puck that are now hugely out of date.

That said I did just send some other stuff that supports the 'not enemy' thing...which we found an event ago. I might go read it again with a suspicious eye. I know that the 'Architect' certainly has some suspicion being aimed at it at the moment as some ancestor noone's heard of before.

[delvy.livejournal.com]

Yeah, well.... um, yeah. There are entire encounters that occurred last year that some of the current plot team have claimed never existed. Despite me having sat through them while they reffed them. Ho hum. Revisionism is the way of the world it seems.

[jfs.livejournal.com]

We co-wrote it :-)

And yes, it made me laugh.

Cos it fulfils the adage "It's all shit, really ..." yet again.

Though to be fair, that write up is "exactly" how the Enemy wanted the Architect to be perceived ....

[binidj.livejournal.com]

Very true, except that reading the entry on Taranis (don't look s0b) it becomes clear that both the Architect and Taranis were ancient ancestors that were 'taken-over' by the Enemy ... so much as I'd love to think that Mister Squiddy is still out there trying to break the world, the evidence points to the contrary.

[die-fleiderhat.livejournal.com]

Reading this sort of thing is very interesting, especially as a relative newcomer to the plot team who is more or less uninvolved with the Architect stuff, both IC and OOC.

[ephraim.livejournal.com]

Did you keep a copy of the original plot docs and write ups? I have copies of most everything that I wrote (somewhere), so will always have the originals to hand.

To extend your Narnia analogy, I tend to look at the evolution/mutilation of the plot that I wrote for the LT as more akin to Slash fic than anything else. OK, so in the original Aslan and the White Witch never got it on; but someone somewhere wanted them to, and that person is probably writing plot for the LT. Patronising? Yes. Unfair? Probably. A good way for me to deal with the whole business? Absolutely.

Lifes too short to worry about what they have done to your babies, and one should always avoid thinking about the revisionist LT gibbon hunched over his keyboard frantically typing with one hand as he...

[quintus.livejournal.com]

You are mistaken citizen, the chocolate ration has always been 25g and was raised to 50g and we have always been at war with Eurasia.

Ignorance is Strength

[smokingboot.livejournal.com]

It is as irritating as all hell when this happens; an entire Sicilian event was based around a Deodati duke who was holding a ball or an auction or something; said gentleman had died more than two years previously during the break-out of plague on Sicilia, part of a past, not just written but roleplayed, to which players had responded a long time before.

I don't see to what extent the LT can be blamed for this kind of thing unless they are writing the faction plot lines themselves. Plot teams do tend to re-create the past, often very badly, cos they want to put their stamp on the faction. It isn't right, but considering how folk re-write real life, I can't be surprised at it.

[oldnick.livejournal.com]

"...and one should always avoid thinking about the revisionist LT gibbon hunched over his keyboard frantically typing with one hand as he..."

...and is that how you wrote your LT plot John? Remember that the person writing it now is just you, or Bin, or John, or Simon a few years down the line. It's not an evil LT 'central' person, it's not someone trying to corrupt what was written before - it's someone in a plot team, writing something to keep the players happy this year and next year, and almost certainly doing it without reference to anything except what remains on the remnants of the old public website.

Perhaps the former writers could, rather than slagging off those that are doing it now, offer them copies (or even the originals - they don't need them now) of their old notes - the unpublished stuff, that said what they had planned as background. The offer might well be ignored, but it would come over a lot better than the bunch of grouchy old men, bitter and twisted moaning about the good old days that people seem determined to show themselves as on their LJs.

[castorlion.livejournal.com]

Having been in pretty much this position, I will state that vicious and deliberate attempts are not being made to rewrite what has been written.

Rather, what is happening is that plot team members are being drawn from the ranks of the faction players, often the longer term players who remember with fondness the plot lines they themselves played through and enjoyed. These plot team members are paying homage to those plot lines, and attempting to both preserve them as part of the setting and also bring a measure of the enjoyment they had to the newer players.

Unfortunately, these plot team members don't have access to behind the scenes information; what they have is information that they and other people uncovered IC - and although we know how unreliable that is, it's still very difficult to acknowledge that what you "know" as "fact" could well be a tissue of lies.

One way or another, whether through lack of communication or through a corruption of information caused by the chinese whispers of NPC replacing etc, the definitive info is not available, and those of us who know you respect your wish to remain LT-negative, therefore making it very hard to approach you for advice on plot lines that you wrote. So the plot team member goes ahead with it anyway, because it's now part of the history, part of the story, and part of legend and because they want it to remain so.

It's not an insult, or deliberate revisionism; it's an attempt to preserve what was written. Misguided, perhaps. But no one is perfect.

[curlwomble.livejournal.com]

IIRC, the Duke was quite young; perhaps it was his heir? Nevertheless it was a super event, capturing, I felt, the essence of Siciila and excellent fun. It reawoke my desire to LARP for another year.

[ephraim.livejournal.com]

offer them copies (or even the originals - they don't need them now) of their old notes - the unpublished stuff, that said what they had planned as background.

Done it. Mr Doran has had the whole of my archive, in an attempt to keep some continuity.

And if I come across as bitter, then it's because I am still bitter. When you throw some much effort, time and heartache into a thing, to have it dismissed by those that come after you is hurtful - even if sometimes it is the right thing to do to keep current players of the game happy.

I try not to look back, as gazing backwards makes me annoyed; but every so often something like this comes along and makes me glance backwards in fury. Its probably not worthy. Its certainly not healthy. But, I'm not going to pretend that its not the way I feel.

Apologies if it offends your sensibilities.

[castorlion.livejournal.com]

When you throw some much effort, time and heartache into a thing, to have it dismissed by those that come after you is hurtful

And sometimes it's not being dismissed. Sometimes it's genuine error. Inevitably, people make mistakes, and to sit there and boil in fury because they've decided to rewrite something you wrote 7 years ago is sometimes doing an injustice to people who are simply trying to carry on the legacy.

During my time on plot team, I didn't have access to information about everything, and I made mistakes about the stuff I did have information on. I wasn't perfect, far from it. But neither was I cackling in the dark about how I was maligning someone's efforts by rewriting what they wrote.

I'm glad he didn't succeed....

[harrytc.livejournal.com]

...would have buggered some of my favourite Viper plot up right royally.

This is my third revision

[smokingboot.livejournal.com]

But I have good reason for it.

I stand corrected; I have just learned the misnomer quoted above was indeed corrected just before the event. There were other inconsistencies, but perhaps not as serious as the host being convincingly deceased!

As for the event, I heard very mixed reports, but then, no event pleases everyone. However, if what you say is right, revising the past however badly, can lead on to good events for the current players, which is perhaps the point. It grates on me, but then I am a writer more than a roleplayer. I think that [info]oldnick's suggestion above is an excellent one.

[pax-draconis.livejournal.com]

Learn not to care, Bin. It's a long time ago, and not actually very important any more. Poking at old sores just makes you hurt; shrug, and allow to yourself that it is only a game, and a pretty silly one at that.

You only ever rent control of this stuff, you don't ever really own it.

[nortysarah.livejournal.com]

I remember Nick playing one of the messengers of the architect way back at that site at the top of the M3. I've got the plot doc's as well. The problem is I don't think any of the current plot team were in the Harts when that event happened...

[binidj.livejournal.com]

"... and those of us who know you respect your wish to remain LT-negative, therefore making it very hard to approach you for advice on plot lines that you wrote."

But that's the thing ... I'm not LT-negative, the only thing keeping me away from the LT (and, indeed from being an NPC again) is health. Do I like Andy King? Nope, not really; but there are a whole shedload of other people that I both like and respect. I don't think I'm the most unapproachable person in the world either.

When I resigned, I did so as a faction leader until such time as they demonstrably got their boundaries sorted out (I was not then, nor am I now, holding my breath on that one). I still think it's a great game, I have a lt of friends who still go there and I still feel quite a strong investment in it.

In fact, I was consulted by the Harts Plot Team on storylines I'd had some involvement with for quite a while after I'd stepped down. I don't think there's a conspiracy, nor do I think the Plot Team is stupid. I do think that it's worthwhile contacting original plotwriters when rewriting their plot because you never know what's gone out into the player domain.

[castorlion.livejournal.com]

You aren't? Well then, I stand corrected and if you'll give me a list of your plot lines I'll be sure to turn up on your doorstep with a dictaphone if I ever join Harts plot again. :-)

hmm

[forbinproject.livejournal.com]

The 'Enemy eating an earlier Ancestor' might be my fault I'm afraid. I think I put summat in to that effect - although I would've thought that I'd have run it past you and SiB.

Dunno, can't remember, I didn't keep any of my plot docs outside of the JFS/Roz/Me Summerlands stuff.

[jfs.livejournal.com]

Perhaps the former writers could, rather than slagging off those that are doing it now, offer them copies (or even the originals - they don't need them now) of their old notes - the unpublished stuff, that said what they had planned as background.

You assume we didn't. You assume that we didn't say "get in touch if you need clarification on this, or even if you want to ask." You assume that we didn't pass over plot documents, and that instead we're hear, looking for a reason to piss and moan.

I'm still pretty LT-negative and haven't been to an LT event since Into The Woods, and haven't run one since the Last Battle. But in the last 12 months I've answered a couple of questions that I've been asked (about House Karlennon history) because to not do so would be unreasonable.

And like binidj, forbinporject, ephraim, westernind, etc. etc. etc. I handed over all of my plot related documents, notes and files to the plot team when I left.

Now - you're expecting us grognards to be psychic - to somehow know that the Architect plot was still ongoing, and that somehow through the power of our ginormous branes that the Harts plot team had got something wrong - something that contradicts what's gone before, and that we should motivate ourselves into getting back in touch with people we don't know and save them from their mistake, assuming that they know who we are and actually don't take umbridge at being contacted out of the blue and being told "you're doing that wrong".

Or, the much simpler solution would have been for someone on Harts plot - perhaps the 4iC if that's still part of their job description, to say "we're running with this plot, and we can try and get in touch with the previous writers."

Our action requires psychic powers, there's requires a bit of forethought.

Re: I'm glad he didn't succeed....

[jfs.livejournal.com]

His first aim was the Harts Ancestors - specifically the Hunter and the Mother. If he'd succeeded in that we'd have then considered his next options.*


(*this is a lie. If the players had failed to stop the Enemy destroying the Hunter and the Mother, I have a feeling plot team at the time would have curled into a collective ball and cried ....)

[jfs.livejournal.com]

But that's the thing ... I'm not LT-negative, the only thing keeping me away from the LT (and, indeed from being an NPC again) is health.

You know, it's just struck me. How many people are like MattMatt and assume that because you stood down, you're automatically LT---?

If it's a common perception, that's an incredibly damning thing.

[jayphoenix.livejournal.com]

I'm still pretty LT-negative and haven't been to an LT event since Into The Woods, and haven't run one since the Last Battle.

You ... along with Roz, Simon, Simon and Bin ... are still very much missed IMnsHO.

But in the last 12 months I've answered a couple of questions that I've been asked (about House Karlennon history) because to not do so would be unreasonable.

Your input (if that relates to any of my queries) always was, and always will be, appreciated. When I first tried the LT you are the reason that I came back for more.

Fessing up

[jcrollie.livejournal.com]

Probably mostly my fault really as I was the 4IC following you guys

I remember thinking same as Matt Matt that some of you would not want to talk about LT and sure I remember a couple of "Your not going to talk to me about LT are you" type comments, although they were probably in jest (and mostly from Schokley!)

I definitely missed (and still do) having you all around as you, Simon, Simon, John and John were big influences on my perception of LRP and plot

Will do better next time!

James